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In this episode Joel and Antonia talk about the ESFP, ESTP, ENFP, and ENTP personality types and how they look when they are healthy.

In this podcast you’ll find:

Part two in the series on healthy expressions of all the types.

Extraverted Perceivers – ESFP, ENFP, ESTP, ENTP

When a person shows up healthy there are certain trends that come out in each of the types that may not match the stereotypes. Sometimes when a person is really healthy they defy their type and show behaviors that are atypical for their type.

Theme with all EPs – when not healthy one thing that is obvious is how unsafe they make the people around them feel. They are spontaneous and rule breakers. They like to take risks. Taking risks is part of the EPs personality, but when it is unhealthy they make the people around them feel unsafe. When healthy, the people around them feel secure.

Healthy Extraverts show up by having a steady energy that is built on slowing down. Typically, Extraverts want to show up with a ton of energy. Type A. But that is not their growth path. The growth path is slowing down. Responsive rather than reactionary.


  • Lead with Se (Extraverted Sensing) but have different copilots. Copilots are our path to growth and happiness. The healthier our relationship with our copilot, the healthier we are overall.
  • In an extraverted type, the copilot is going to be introverted.
  • These two types will appear very different when healthy because of that different copilot.

Stereotypes – Adrenaline junkies, athletes, performers.

Non-stereotypes/healthy – Not always about an adrenaline rush. Sometimes about performance.


  • Driver – Extraverted Sensing (Se) – Very in-the-moment way of taking in info. What is going on right now based upon the body’s senses. Asks “What can happen here and now?”
  • Copilot – Introverted Feeling (Fi) – Decision making process. Asks “How do you really feel about this decision?”
  • Stereotype – Performer
  • The sign of a healthy ESFP:
    • Use their body as an instrument. Not frenetic. Steady thanks to Tertiary Te.
    • High sense of integrity. Aversion to exploitation.
    • Show up honestly. Sensitive to feedback of world.
    • Puts others at ease. Action rooted from groundedness 
  • Unhealthy ESFP:
    • Can be exploitative.
    • Like quick solutions that aren’t sustainable.
    • Energetically frenetic and unfocused.



  • Same Driver as ESFP above
  • Copilot – Introverted Thinking (Ti)- Decision making process. Good at understanding data and how it fits within frameworks. ESTP can appear divorced from people because of Ti’s need for accuracy over emotional connection.
  • Stereotype – Firefighters
  • The sign of a healthy ESTP:
    • A healthy ESTP listens and allows input because there is no real danger in what you have to say. They don’t fear truth because they have already embraced the hard truths.
    • They appear calm.
    • Healthy ESTPs who have found congruence are only concerned with what makes sense. Relationships don’t make sense, but they know they can relate to emotions logically. Anger is not logical. It’s toxic.
    • When they remove the anger component they replace the vacuum with compassion. Bill Burr – ESTP – rats himself out about the stupid things he does with his displays of anger. He knows it’s not acceptable.
    • Fe 10 year old lets them be enough in touch with people enough so that they can gauge the best possible use of their Ti.
    • The healthier the ESTP the more hospitable they are.
    • Not afraid of truth.
    • People rest into them because they seem like they can handle any situation.
  • Unhealthy ESTP:
    • Unhealthy ESTPs flee from truth. They may show up as someone dealing with cognitive dissonance. If the world is showing them a truth that they don’t want to hear, they will attempt to dominate conversations. Constant output.
    • Stereotype – ESTPs can be kind of harsh and invasive when unhealthy. Push-pull relationship with 10 yr old Fe (Extraverted Feeling). There is a sense that the only acceptable emotion is a powerful emotion – which is usually anger. Bullying.


  • Lead with Ne (Extraverted Intuition) but have different copilots. Copilots are our path to growth and happiness. The healthier our relationship with our copilot, the healthier we are overall.
  • In an extraverted type, the copilot is going to be introverted.
  • These two types will appear very different when healthy because of that different copilot.


  • Driver – Extraverted Intuition (Ne) – all about finding patterns in outside world. Messing with things to discover patterns. Interested in “what if” questions. Possibilities oriented. Optimization. Anything can happen.
  • Copilot – Same as ESFP – Introverted Intuition (Fi) – Decision making process. Asks “How do you really feel about this decision?” Paired with Ne, Asks “What can happen with this person? What is their potential?” Very inspirational.
  • Copilot paired with 10 year old Extraverted Thinking (Te) – “Now that I know what your potential is, now let’s make sure you have the tools you need to be able to accomplish your goals.”
  • The sign of a healthy ENFP:

    • Slow down their decision making process and let Fi have the time it needs to function efficiently.
    • ENFPs are very inspirational to others and makes others feel safe.
    • Healthy ENFPs use people through inspiration rather than manipulation. Pulling instead of pushing.
  • Unhealthy ENFP:
    • When an ENFP bypasses their copilot and goes to the 10 year old they can become exploitative. Taking harmful Short cuts. Te is not sustainable – just fast. Can trample over other people. Fi allows ENFPs to feel sympathy.
    • ENFPs can still be charming even in the the unhealthy state, which makes them great con men.
    • Often utilize people as props to accomplish certain things.


  • Driver same as ENFP – Extraverted Intuition
  • Copilot same as ESTP – Introverted Thinking: “What makes sense?” Decisions based upon “what if” questions.
  • The sign of a healthy ENTP:

    • At best, ENTPs use driver and copilot together and become profound problem solvers.
    • ENTPs will slow down thinking process and be thoughtful.
    • They look at data in a clean and pure, unemotional way. This allows them to accept truth at face value without stumbling over the pain points.
    • Debates in an attempt to hone skills, not dominate or humiliate. Willing to lose if the ultimate goal of truth has been attained.
    • Call out incongruities in people’s reasoning without humiliating them. They don’t bludgeon others with truth but use compassion to help other people understand truths that are hard to swallow.
    • Healthier ENTPs turn Fe into compassion through camaraderie. Community involvement and improvement. John Oliver has a talent for spotting incongruities, and he uses comedy to expose societal wrongs.
    • Endeavors to make sense of other people instead of just dismissing them. Finds connection and compassion through Fe.
  • Unhealthy ENTP:
    • Unhealthy they will separate themselves from their copilot. Like ESTP, they are trying to avoid a painful truth, so they will separate themselves from their copilot Ti.
    • Like ESTPs, they get in continual output mode, but come across as know-it-alls.
    • They focus on fixing everybody else’s problems.
    • Competitive. One upmanship.
    • A tendency to see everyone else as stupid.
    • Debating in an attempt to humiliate the opponent.
    • Like ESTPs, are drawn to anger as an emotional expression when engaged with tertiary Fe. ENTPs don’t get as angry as ESTPs. It usually shows up as sarcastic and biting to those around them.

All the types have a place in the social ecosystem:

  • ENTPs help the world accept difficult truths
  • ENFPs help thru inspiration
  • ESTP find solutions to everyday problems
  • ESFP figure out the human condition and reflect it back to us

We need each of these types.

EXTRAVERTS: You will have to ignore feedback that encourages you to not slow down. We are living in a very extraverted time in history and it rewards extraversion. Force yourself to slow down!


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Showing 9 comments
  • Alethea Mshar

    My husband is ESTP. He has, as he has matured, become that protector. He is also a strong mentor and teacher in law enforcement, his chosen career.

  • Kent

    Kent – ENFP – 31 yo Male (Enneagram 7w6 for anyone who cares)

    Hi guys, love your podcasts & the intuitive way you’ve presented typology in your car model – it has really helped others to understand cognitive functions when I’m talking about personality around them. So thank you for creating this wonderful framework, you guys are doing amazing things!

    As an ENFP, I’ve (naturally) expressed my personality type in both healthy & unhealthy ways through my life. I feel like I’ve gotten healthier as I’ve aged, so let’s start with the healthy side! I’ve noticed that when I’m healthy, I tend to be expressing my Authenticity (Fi) via my Exploration (Ne) & Effectiveness (Te) functions. People will often come to me for advise, and as I talk to them I tend to use questions & comments as probes (Ne in use) to help me understand how they perceive the world, and what would be the most authentic, effective way that they can respond (Te in use) to whatever issue they brought to me. There have been a number of people who have changed their approach to life based on our talks… which is fairly surprising to me, since I have only partially “gotten my shit together” in my own life. Still, I feel best when I’m helping others to be the best that they can be – creating positive momentum in others people’s lives feels very right & natural to me. On the flip side, it can be tough to create that same inspiration for improvement in my own life, and I’ve found that I need other people to fill that role for me.

    When I thought about how I’ve expressed my ENFP unhealthily, I think I see a couple of patterns. Growing up in a family of (mostly) SJ types, I was a bit of a black sheep; they thought I might be autistic when they saw my intuitive approach to the world, and emotional expression was strictly discouraged. There was a time when I was a preteen that I realized I would be rewarded for showing my family what they wanted to see, while I would be discouraged & disparaged when I expressed my Ne/Fi combo. This caused me to grow up basically being an actor portraying a crow-pleasing character, with my family as an audience. Skipping over my Authenticity (Fi) allowed me to emotionally survive in an environment where my authentic self wasn’t welcome, and I essentially let my Te hijack control. Just as you said in the podcast, I ended up acting like a con man. This was profoundly unhealthy for me, as my Fi was practically screaming at me that my life was off track, while my Ne & Te were doing their best to protect Fi from familial aggression. It created a lot of anger that took years to work through, and caused me to have a strong distrust of emotions in my early 20s. In my late 20s were spent in an abusive relationship, I was often in the grip of Si (living entirely by routine, no variation, staying safe) and was forced to develop my Fi better so I could draw healthier boundaries & figure out how to handle my toxic marriage.

    One thing I’ve noticed in myself & others is that during times of extreme stress, it seems like judgement functions invert their directions. For example, my judgement functions are Fi/Te; when I’m extremely stressed, I will blow up & extravert my emotions into the outside world like an Fe user (to terrible results), while getting trapped in my head & struggling to express my ideas like a Ti user (also to terrible results). I’ve noticed that friends who are Ti/Fe users will tend to brood on their emotions while expressing their thoughts when extremely stressed, which is (again) opposite to their natural pattern. I haven’t noticed that pattern with perception functions, only with the decision making ones. Is this judgement function inversion something you guys have noticed as well?

  • C

    Hi there, I enjoyed this episode (and the one before) very much. I have one question and one pledge, though:
    1. Is it common or possible that an ENTP gets clingy and … sorry, needy when faced with potential loss? I noticed this behavior with a person I assume to be an ENTP and I assumed it was the Fe which I translated in this case as a need for harmony and I’d appreciate your insight on this.
    2. Could you please continue providing one or two examples of healthy types in the following episodes? I found those examples extremely enlightening (especially John Oliver [or his screen persona]).
    Thanks a lot!

  • Kirin

    Well, as an ENTP I can agree at that `that’s stupid`part. I noticed that my brain works like some kind of strainer. It leaves only the data that makes any sense to it and throws away the data that it finds stupid or nonsensical. And I do that in terms of people as well. I have a low tolerance for stupidity, especially that of humans. My biggest challenge was to work as a consultant in a certain telemarketing company in my country. People craved for obvious information and I forced myself to be polite to the extend that my boss presented my conversations with clients to my coworkers as an example of a role model consultant while I was about to completely lose my faith in humanity (I even wanted to leave my country as fast as possible). In fact, I’m aware that my current state is faaar from being healthy and the situation even worsened due to some external factors.

    One-manship… `I am more skilled at that matter, so let me do it all alone` thing….yeah.

    Also… Arguing with supervisors and tutors at my uni because `I didn’t learn by heart the entire material so I described the thing using my own logic, I wrote the same stuff as in the book, I just used different words, why am I wrong?`. Later on, I aborted that idea of arguing, because it became obviously nonsensical.

    However, on the positive side, I like to enlight people and to use suggestions instead of bossing them around. I catch myself on clarifying things to others in humorous way or on giving a long lecture why, for instance zombie apocalypse should be considered as an utter bullshit. Now I think, I should use this side of mine more often.

    Thank you for this podcast!

  • Gregor

    I’m an ENTP and I’ve learned to prioritize and focus my competitiveness on becoming a better dad. I’ve upgraded my desire to be someone important globally to bring someone important to my family. I have made conscious efforts to “take back my time.” I’m married to an ISFP and she has been a tremendous help in teaching me to slow down. Here practical wisdom also keeps me from showing up as a know-it-all…sometimes. My one question is traversing introverted sensing. I’ve made a lot of effort to be responsible and o notice that I’m dismissive, unforgiving, and disgusted by other EP who can’t get their act together. Is my ability to pay bills on time and keep a budget a function of accuracy or memory? And is it a result of being married to an ISFP who is less organized than o am? Have you noticed that in marriages where both partners extravert their learning function that one of them end up being the “bad guy” with reasonability?

  • RedMelodyflashT.

    Great ! We have to SLOW DOWN. That’s all very true. Thanks to both of you ENFP and ENTP types that is useful like all your videos !

  • Shelly

    Hello, thanks, really interesting podcasts. I like when you give examples of people that I know. In the ENFP person, you talked about a character that uses people as props in their manipulations/games. What movie is this? I would like to watch it so I can see an example of what you are talking about. I’m an INTJ and am busy creating new patterns in my brain for how all the 16 different personality types show up. Is watching movies useful? Can you suggest 1 or 2 other movies that have great character personality types and why? Thanks, really enjoying your work and learning about how to recognize these patterns in people. It helps me to better understand how other people are thinking and motivated. (OMG! Perspectives! How thrilling!) thanks, you guys are an amazing team.

  • RMN

    Effectiveness hijacking control yes, that is a not so healthy Enfp. I’ve had a lot of great results with slowing down and allowing authenticity to grow…as mentioned on another talk. Was very fascinated by the concept of our risk taking scaring other people or when appropriately balanced or channeled, creating safety. I don’t know if its typical for Enfp to be as dominant as I am. I do not change certain parts of me very easily at all! Even with fair amount of pressure. Very internally driven, and, I think, analytical. Definitely like to know who I’m with well enough that I know exactly how much I can push or pull the box of expectations without getting a negative reaction (or in some cases, I don’t care as long as it completely aligned with my values). Glad for the recommendation to pull not push.

  • Angie

    Anyone else listening to the description of an unhealthy EsTP keep having this picture of Donald trump dominating their minds. I know we aren’t supposed to weaponize the MBTI but man he is all of those things.

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