Podcast – Episode 0106 – How Types Say “I Love You”
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In this episode Joel and Antonia talk about how each of the Myers Briggs types say “I love you.”
In this podcast you’ll find:
Please reference the article How Does Each Type Say, “I Love You?”
Based upon the program Personalities in Marriage and Relationship
Looking at the 4 decision making or judging functions and how they express and receive love.
Judging Functions determine how we evaluate information and criteria. When we are giving and receiving love we are accessing what we place value on. The Judging Process is how we determine how things should be. Love is very much based upon how we think the world should be. It’s a transaction between two people. The Judging Function is incredibly influential in how all of us experience love.
First Cluster: FJ (ENFJ, INFJ, ESFJ, ISFJ) – The Judging Process they all share is Extraverted Feeling (Fe) or Harmony.
Harmony is how these types make decisions. They worry about keeping harmony with people and getting everyone’s needs met.
How do Harmony users ask, “Do you love me?”
Extraverted Feeling is very interested in emotional interplay between people. They find satisfaction with interpersonal connection. “Your feeling matches my feeling.” In tune. All 4 types are insanely interested in connection. “Do you feel connected to me?”
When getting everyone else’s needs met, FJs need to remember to get their own needs met. A massive sign of love to Fe users is if those in their lives check in to make sure their needs are also being met. It takes the burden off the Fe user. “Will you acknowledge and take care of my needs?” “Will you take action to get MY needs met?”
“Am I safe with you?” Since Fe users are made to express emotion in the outside world, they are very in touch with other’s emotions. This puts them in a vulnerable space. Fe users have to know they are safe. That their vulnerability is going to be honored. Harmony (Fe) users are the most vulnerable to emotional terrorists, crazy makers, unstable hangers-on, etc.
“Do you accept and approve of me?” Giving and withholding approval in social groups. If someone withholds approval it can be a sign they don’t love you. This is the marker Fe users are tuned into.
How do Harmony users tell others they love them?
“I will meet your needs before I meet my own.” Fe cannot help themselves from meeting the needs of others first. If an Fe user is not caring about the needs of another person it is because they don’t’ consider them in their intimate sphere. Fe user will check in regularly to make sure the ones they love are okay. They are emotionally tuned in to those around them.
“I will do my best to keep morale up.” Fe users are very impacted by the energy and emotions of others, so they like to make sure everyone is feeling good.
“I will show you appreciation in whatever way I like to be shown appreciation.” We all overvalue our experience, So it is common to believe other people think the same as we. If someone is communicating something particular to their type but meaningless to us it is easy to reject that gift. Like knocking a taco out of someone’s hand. We don’t understand the gift they are offering so we reject it because it doesn’t mirror our ideals. If you are in a relationship with Fe user, remember that when they show you appreciation don’t devalue it. Take note that these are the things they would like to be appreciated for.
Fe users can feel intrusive as they keep trying to check in emotionally. Misinterpreted as smothering. Harmony users tend to be very service oriented, and other types may resent such acts of service. Fe are appreciative when they get feedback about their service – good or bad. They want to know how to provide the best service to others.
Second Cluster: FP (ENFP INFP ESFP ISFP) – The Judging Process they all share is Introverted Feeling (Fi) or Authenticity.
They are very concerned with what resonates on the inside in a core value way.
“What is in alignment with me?” “What feels right to do in this situation?”
Introverted Feeling is private – “My feelings.” ”What I am experiencing.” “What is true to what I am?”
Identity gets wrapped up in it. Fi users don’t like to shine it on for morale. They recognize that people have an entire array of emotional, subjective experience.
How do Authenticity users ask, “Do you love me?”
“Do you think I’m being real with you?” “Do you trust my motives and intent?” Intent is very important to Fi users. It is very hard for people of this type to express the amount of darkness they see as the human experience. Fi users go thru the whole array of human emotions. Most of us can imagine disturbing, horrific acts, but Authenticity users can actually understand why someone would commit such a heinous act. They can feel the motivation for such things in their hearts – even if they would never do it. Which is scary.
If you are the kind of person who can not only understand the whole array of human darkness but can also find a part of you that could imagine doing that, then intent becomes really important. Intent to stay in the light is all Fi users have.
Other types don’t get how deep this goes for Fi user. Intent and motive is all they’ve got to insure that they are not staying in that dark space.
Questioning their motive can totally shake Authenticity users up. The question laced into their interactions with loved ones is, “Are you trusting my intent and understanding that my motives are good?”
Sometimes language can break down in articulating their feelings, so Fi users will sometimes ask, “Do you have my back?” “Do you know I have good intent even if I can’t explain why something is important to me?” “Will you give me space to be me?”
The Pygmalion Project is our tendency to get into a relationship based upon polarities then try and make the other person just like us. This is profoundly offensive to an Fi user. They want to be recognized as a separate, unique individual and they need to know that those who love them will not attempt to change them into someone else.
How do Authenticity users tell others they love them?
They honor the individual and the authentic expressions of those they love. Other types might let you emote but then walk out after emotionally distancing themselves. But Fi users will hold space for you to say what you need to say, even if it is painful.
They also honor peoples alone time to process their feelings. “We might not be cool, and you walking away might be terrifying, but I know that is what you need so I am going to give you the space you need.” “I’ve got your back no matter what we are fighting over.”
They will also trust that you have their best interests at heart.
Misinterpreted as passive or self absorbed. The very opposite of the intrusiveness of Harmony. Fi users create sympathy by self referencing. It can seem like self absorption to others, but that is how they understand what you are going through. Undeveloped Fi can be passive and self absorbed. If you are projecting onto people these negative qualities, make sure that it is not a legitimate complaint.
Cluster 3: TJ (ENTJ, INTJ, ESTJ, ISTJ) – The Judging Process they all share is Extraverted Thinking (Te) or Effectiveness.
“What works?” “What is the most effective means to accomplish this goal?” This applies to love as well. Love can be vetted through thinking processes.
Love transcends type. Love transcends all models. It isn’t the provence of any Cognitive Function, type or model. How we experience love is personalized.
How do Effectiveness users ask, “Do you love me?”
“Will you handle things?” “Can I rely on you to get your job done?” “Do I have to sit here and worry that you are getting things done?”
There are certain things that create burdens on each of us, so we choose the ones that will go through life with us because we think they will help us relieve those burdens. It’s a burden for Te users to worry about the other person getting things done. “If I can’t rely on you to get things done that is a burden for me.”
“Will you make my life easier?” “Can I relax?” Te are some of the most goal oriented of all the types. They need to know that they will receive the necessary support to accomplish their goals.
Not to say they expect perfection from their spouses, but overtime on a consistent basis, are you fulfilling your obligations?
Te users don’t handle emotional terrorism or neediness. They like to set up systems and forget about them because they assume the systems will function alone. Loyalty becomes important. They set up a system that is a relationship so they can move on to other priorities. They will assume all is okay.
If you break loyalty with a Te user it can break their heart because they have expected you to work within a functioning system. Long term sustainable system.
How do Effectiveness users tell others they love them?
“I will be endlessly loyal on principle.” This doesn’t’ mean Te users will never cheat on spouses. There are various levels of health with all types. But Te loyalty isn’t based upon sex, it is based upon care.
“I will take care of you.” “I will never drop you.” “I will be endlessly loyal.” Healthy versions of this would be sexual loyalty as well.
It’s really about resource loyalty. “I will educate myself on you and learn how you operate.” “What is your daily routine?” They see their partners as a system or resource to learn about and master.
They take pride in their spouse and boast about their accomplishments. “I got the best!” “I attracted this amazing person!”
When a Te user chooses to be in love they don’t necessarily express it on a daily basis. “If anything changes you will know.” “I said I loved you once. I married you. Nothing has changed.”
They don’t suffer fools lightly, or a bad relationship for long. They will generally find an exit strategy rather than stay in something that is falling apart. If they are with someone, that means they have chosen that person. That is love. They stick with their decisions.
If they really feel connected to their spouse they might not be effusive with words of affirmation but they do get cuddly and show a squishy vulnerability that most people don’t see.
Can be misinterpreted as controlling. Distant. They aren’t always spontaneous lovers. They won’t buy surprise tickets to Paris. Te users like to know what is coming up and make plans. If romance is defined by unpredictable displays of affection, Te may appear unromantic. But they are anything but.
Cluster 4: TP (ENTP, INTP, ESTP, ISTP) – The Judging Process they all share is Introverted Thinking, or Accuracy.
Accuracy users ask, “What makes sense to me?” “What makes logical analytical sense?” Ti is thought turned inward. Resources are internal. Data and info need to be congruent.
How do Accuracy users ask, “Do you love me?”A lot of the ways they express and receive love is through competency. They hate having their competency called into question. One way they know their spouse loves them is the spouse indicates their confidence in their competency.
“Do you believe I am competent enough to figure this out?” “Are you impressed with my performance?”
The more Ti love people the more they desire their approval. They don’t care as much about people outside their circle of intimacy.
They also choose partners whose competency they value. And they value the feedback of those who they perceive as competent.
They want approval but will learn from, and value, negative feedback. They like others to refine their talents and skills.
“Can I trust that you don’t think I’m lying to you in any way?” A major part of Ti relationships is radical honesty. “If I say, ‘I love you’ it is because I love you. If I say I am pissed at you it is because I am pissed at you. But I am going to be as accurate as possible with my communication with you.”
“I will put time, effort and thought into how I craft my language with you.” Communication with intellectual integrity. Partners of Ti users have to learn that they are saying exactly what they mean. There’s no duality with them. Take them at face value. Ti users will usually not have much of a connection with anyone who tries to shine it on.
Ti users all need to know that it makes sense for you to love them. There is logical consistency in how you express love. Ti might ask “Why are you with me?” “What about this relationship makes you want to stay with me?” Relationships are not always easy for Ti. They are trying to make sense of something that doesn’t have a lot of sense around it.
How do Accuracy users tell others they love them?
“I will be rigorously honest with you. If I am not free to be honest, I lose interest in that relationship.”
The more Ti users love somebody the more they have freed up space to be honest with them. Ti learn their mate at a precision level.
Ti protects their loved ones from other people but not themselves. They like the same treatment in return. “If you’ve got stuff going on for you that is your test iterate. I’m going to support you but I’m not going to protect you.”
Misinterpreted as harsh, insensitive and cold. This can a legitimate sign of an undeveloped Accuracy user, or it can be a sign of their love. Gifts the Ti gives to their spouse: Gift of competence, and Gift of radical honesty.
Ask yourself, Is this person legitimately at a low level of development, or are you seeing them through your lens of your evaluative criteria?
Step back and hold all these styles in an objective way first. Instead of looking at everything thru your filters.
Take these ideas and start to examine yourself and your mate and see where some of these are cross wired. Can you take the lead in your relationship and start communicating love in a way that makes sense to them?
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OMG!!!! This was unbelievable ♥️♥️♥️‼️
It’s enlightening. I am an NT (female) and my partner is an FP (male). I can now see how we are so different in the way we show and receive love. It’s been a struggle. I hope that I can take what I learn from your podcast to make my relationship better.
My 17 year marriage is ending and I feel like you’ve been listening to our arguments. I’m an INFP and the words you’ve used to describe my needs – particularly about ‘having my back’ are plucked from my own words. I don’t know how many times I’ve tried to explain this concept to my husband, and how many times I’ve been crushed when he has *not* had my back, hasn’t even realized that he walked away from this crucial need.
As sad as I am about my impending divorce, I feel so incredibly relieved to know that I’m not a freak, that there are other people out there like me and people who can “get” me.
I found this article confusing. I am still unsure about my type, but I could relate 100% of BOTH the FJ and FP sections. Also, my husband is ONLY an ESTP or ISTP, but then he loves exactly like what you described in the TJ section…so yes, I was left very confused on this one.
This was such an incredible podcast. Very insightful, helpful, and useful. One thing I wanted to add from a TP perspective, was how our spontaneity can show up as that surprise romantic gesture. The podcast mentioned how TJs are more scheduled and don’t speak that way, and as TP loving a TJ, we’ve laughed about how much I love to surprise her and how far out her comfort zone it is to receive it. I’m not competent (lol) enough in the other types to know if surprises are on the radar for them, but I felt this aspect was missed in the TP discussion. Thanks for all you’re sharing with us PH.
I am an INTJ. These podcasts are spot on. They really describe me to a T and help me understand myself. Thank you!
I classify as an INTJ – emotional introvert, yet in the text above INTJ’s are call extraverts. (not “extro_?)
Please explain?
I’m also highly empathic.
INTJs lead with an introverted learning process, but their Judging (decision-making) process is extraverted. So, we aren’t calling INTJs extraverts. We are saying they use an extraverted judging process (aka Extraverted Thinking). For more explanation, read this article: https://www.personalityhacker.com/intj-personality-type/
As to why we use extraverted instead of extroverted, Carl Jung used Extraverted because it was based upon the Latin word “extra” or “outside.” Intro means “inside”. Jung believed IntrOverts turn inward, whereas ExtrAverts turn outward. “Extro” is simply bad Latin. Psychology journals use Extra. https://blogs.scientificamerican.com/beautiful-minds/the-difference-between-extraversion-and-extroversion/
Oh my goodness! My dad is a TJ, and I am a TP and this explains so many things that my dad has done. My dad always does his job very well, and when we don’t do our job well he becomes very angry. I think he thinks that when we don’t do our job we are saying that we don’t love him, but really we are just being lazy. Also my dad always wants the house to be clean, and I sort of understand that, but I don’t need my surroundings to be that organized, so he gets angry with me when I don’t do my job as accurately as he would want, but by my standards it is as done or as clean as it needs to be.
Thanks for sharing, Sivana! 🙂
I know the struggle – I’m a TP son of a TJ Dad! Your comments are my experience EXACTLY!! So wonderful though to put words to my struggles, sheds some light on what’s going on
I loved this podcast. As an ENFP male who has been with an ISTJ female, it was very telling. We have struggled, but we are also both on this path of learning about each other and trying to understand how we think. Started with the love languages, but that was so generic and while it did help some, this was so much more helpful.
The thing I have loved is that I make sure I take things off her list. Her car needs oil, that’s on me. She hates filling up the car with gas, I try to do that. She breaks something like her glasses, I go get them fixed. I can see it upsets her and frustrate her when those things come up, and I just do it. No asking for payback or you owe me, I just get them done. And as I read this podcast, I didn’t realize how much that helps her and how she receives love that way. But I think I must have sensed it (my intuition) because while task oriented items are not my strong point, I love doing them for her.
On the flip side, I’ve never been with someone that allows me to be me. I’ll get on myself for something and she is the first one to tell me, “don’t be silly, why should you feel guilty or embarrassment for that…you love doing it so enjoy” She not only indulges my impulses, but she looks at me in this kind of fascination and then goes right along with me. I remember one month I made this little plan of something we would do everyday…just some fun texts saying how we loved each other. It didn’t quite work out and after a couple of weeks, I decided to stop it as it wasn’t having the desired intent. Won’t go into the details, but she started it with me…when it wasn’t working she never joked about it with me or made fun…she just said “ok, let’s stop”. Typical ENFP who tries something first and then sees if it fits.
I’ve never had someone let me be me and let me grow and let me fail and just have my back regardless. She has never once tried to mold me into something she thinks I should be and that is the first time I’ve ever been in a relationship like that. And after listening to this it was like “holy crap…that’s one of the reasons I love her so much and would do anything for her.” That truly is how I feel most loved…don’t tell me to “grow up” or “man up”…this is me and for someone to see that and embrace that and get me out of my head when I get embarrassed if one of my ideas falls flat…this podcast really had me smiling the entire time.
Love these podcasts. Keep up the great work!!
Thanks for the comment, Liam! I love how much appreciation you express for your wife here. You’re a great example. 🙂
Hi there I’m an INTJ. The few friends I have consider me to be cold when it comes to relationships. They say it is because I have no problems walking away from a relationship if I think that it isn’t working or they lie. I trust very seldom and when I’m in a relationship and I find out the person has lied to me about things I will leave. I don’t see it as being cold as I would rather end an unhealthy relationship then pretend and prolong both sides misery.
i am laughing a little bit while listening to the part about FPs re: the worst thing to do to an authenticity user is to try to get them to be like you. i am an INFP dating an ISFP, and while we rarely do this to each other intentionally about Big Things, we do sometimes get into tiffs about the way certain little things should be done.
I loved this podcast soooo much! It helped me realize I was mistyped and send me on a path to more accurately type myself. It also reframed my marriage which has been amazing. I realized I am accuracy married to effectiveness which is not a bad combination because neither of us is particularly emotive, but made me wonder if we were business partners or lovers. Realized it is both and that is okay and normal for us. It helps to know all those “controlling” behaviors are his “I love you” they stopped bothering me so much. The reframe from feeling like I was disappointing him with my performance to understanding that he feels comfortable and supported when people follow his system. He was so relieved when I told him how I understood where he was coming from and has altered his presentation to a more relaxed “I really like it when you do it this way” feedback which has resulted in us easily feeling like we are on the same page again. Thank you for putting this out there. Your discussions are refreshing and enlightening.
I’m a newly discovered ENFP, and this one was an eye opener for me.
It explains why a new relationship with a much younger INTJ went south very quickly. It happens, part of the game, but this gave me some clues as to why it went down the way it did.
I did not understand her interest and intent, so true to an Authenticity user, I w anted to understand her motives, being honest with how I was feeling, and asking her to clarify.
Meanwhile, she was doing what Effectiveness users do, trying to learn how I work, collecting clues and attempting to understand what makes me tick.
Essentially, we were both attempting to grow the connection in the ways that are common to our types, but not recognizing the same attempt in each other.
After reading this, I think it’s a miracle that Authenticity and Effectiveness users ever get together. I think both would have to be pretty darn mature, or so smitten that they didn’t give up easily.
I really appreciate the time spent discussing the deep value of intent for Authenticity users (myself, an INFP). I’ve coincidentally been thinking about the natural disposition of the heart this week for a sermon outline I was writing for a class. I know many people believe in the fundamental goodness of everyone – that “most people” are “good” and have best intentions. And honestly, because I can empathize with motivations of some of the very darkest of actions, I am prone to disagree with that.
Perhaps that is a defensive response. Because if most people are in fact prone to goodness, and I have to constantly battle (and often lose) against what I believe is darkness (primarily for me apathy, thoughtlessness, and selfishness), then I am one of the few bad people. And motives are primary to me. When I am busy, I have often been asking myself “am I busy because I can’t say ‘no’, or am I busy doing things that bring me life?”. When I am serving or compassionate, I am asking myself “Am I doing this as selflessly as I can for this person, or am I motivated by obligation or a desire for recognition?”. When I type it out, it sounds all very tedious, but it is just naturally how I process such things.
All of that to say, I absolutely agree that if you want to show me you love me, acknowledge the motivation of my heart. If you see me coming from the wrong place, (gently) call me out on it. Because I know you love me if you are preparing me to be happy with my motivations upon retrospection. Also, sometimes, just sit with me. I cannot express to you in words all the emotions or thoughts inside of me, but to know you’re “with me” physically eases and comforts me in ways I cannot articulate.
Thank you for sharing those two questions you ask yourself. They really resonated with me, and I wrote them down to remember them.
It is interesting that I could relate to a lot of what Antonia said about the need for TP types to communicate and hear honesty in their relationship. I feel that same need for intellectual integrity myself as an INTJ. I wonder how this would be different for me as an INTJ. I feel I can relate to this part of the podcast discussion more than the “Effectiveness” component because for INTJ, I believe love and integrity are very much connected to our sense of loyalty and fidelity. There are certain types of behavior, certain lines I would not cross in my relationship because to do so would feel not only as a betrayal of the other person, but also myself. The part about boasting about one’s spouse did not resonate with me at all, btw! I might feel proud of my spouse and their accomplishments, but I would never leverage or display that pride in a social settings. Being a private and reserved person, it’s not my style. I think an INTJ Type 3 (if there is such a combination?) or even an ENTJ would be more likely to behave in this way.
I appreciated Joel’s comment about the difficulty in sometimes taking a non type F? kind of person at face value. I have experienced a related kind of frustration with some F types at times, I believe, as an INTJ. People are not always prepared for honesty – and I am not referring necessarily to brutal “in your face” INTJ blatant “cold feeling” honesty, I mean just being honest, no pretense, no spin, no ulterior motives. It’s difficult to explain this… I think sometimes ‘authenticity’ is easier when you are not trying… that is..if you are just being present to reality and what is before you… the person, the circumstances, the place. Honesty doesn’t always require evoking feeling states – sometimes it’s just a space that comes from a place of trusting or *knowing* the other person or other thing as you are experiencing it. Maybe that’s Ni speaking?
btw: Hmm. Wondering how ‘radical honesty’ is experienced differently for an ENTP and an INTJ, Antonia because I feel exactly the way you feel about other people. This part of the podcast is confusing for me – ‘Accuracy’ types versus those who possess ‘Authenticity’ functions. Perhaps ‘radical honesty’ is less a function of being a NP and more a function of healthy psychological development. This is because once a person has done depth work, this person is less likely going to tolerate or being interested in inauthentic human exchanges. That doesn’t seem like it should be type dependent. This is just an observation…
I think it should also be noted that INTJs like more than anything else for people and things to make sense. Perhaps this is a commonality between INTJs and TP types in the way (or maybe I have lived with TPs too long and they’ve brainwashed me!) As Antonia acknowledged, people don’t always make sense, love doesn’t always make sense. This can really trip up the INTJ too (especially if a FP type is in the picture). It’s like someone has taken out our brain, played with the circuitry and dismantled it.
Antonia’s comments about the ‘casserole’ and need for authentic feedback was interesting. I have both an INTP husband and daughter. My daughter is a Type 3, whereas my husband is a Type 5. I think the need to feel competent and receive meaningful feedback is there for both. However, when a Type 3, I think there tends to be a stronger pull for approval. Both the INTPs like it when they feel they have gotten it ‘right’. It makes them feel happy and loved when I give them positive feedback. They both love to cook as it is a passion of theirs. So I know that they are invested in the process of preparation, execution, presentation, etc. — and I know that part of that investment comes from a place of love. They really want me to enjoy what they have prepared. If I end up not liking it so much (like too spicy or too salty) I know they will try harder next time. But maybe (because I know they value my opinion) I am not always as honest as I could be because I recognize that we all share perfectionist tendencies. It’s not something I want or need to encourage. The food is always good – sometimes it’s better than other times. For me, the fact that I know that, perhaps, technically, could have been a little better, is irrelevant because I know that they have made an effort to please me. The rest is not really important. Getting a Type 3 to step out of performance mode, I find, can be difficult at times. I’m a Type 1 – the Perfectionist. I think it’s interesting that we are Type 1, 3 and 5 – all of the competency types of the Enneagram. I think the Enneagram type plays into the subtle nuances of Meyers-Briggs Types too. This makes it all the more complex, dynamic and interesting to study.
I loved this podcast. Thank you so much.
Last comment… I promise… Lol.
I’d highly recommend the book “How to be an Adult in Relationships: The Five Keys to Mindful Loving” by David Richo to Antonia and Joel (and whoever else who is interested in love styles).
http://www.amazon.com/How-Be-Adult-Relationships-Mindful/dp/1570628122
It’s written from a Buddhist mindfulness perspective. Although I am not a practicing Buddhist myself, I find it to be a rich book full of wisdom about the nature of love and relationships. I have found myself returning to this book many times. It’s one of those books that I feel has me coming away with something new after each time I have read even a section of it. It’s a book definitely worth time in contemplation and study. Best…
As a Harmony-type married to an Accuracy type, this podcast was full of helpful information. I spent the first 3 years of our marriage with my feelings hurt, but learning about personality types changed the whole trajectory of our relationship. We’ve now been married for 16 and have learned how to communicate with each other and accept/honor the differences. The line in this podcast that managed to explain a lot about my husband (because I’m still learning) to me was that Accuracy types will protect you from other people but not from yourself. I’ve often felt hurt or resentful because it seems like he gives other people all the latitude in the world but can be hard on me and leaves me to sink or swim on my own. He is not a mean or indifferent person so this never made sense to me until I heard that line. It is so perfect and so true and now when this situation comes up I will be able to look at it with a completely different perspective. So thanks!
Thanks for the feedback, Jaime! I’m glad the info was so useful to you. 🙂
I listened to this primarily to learn how I, (an INTJ), and my wife, (an ISFJ), communicate love. I realize that in your podcast that it was said that you trust that the listeners will understand that INTJ and the other four are not “cheaters”; I felt it necessary to write that you are right, we are not; but we, especially my type, always get labeled as a cheater, unemotional, etc. My wife has accused me of cheating so many times I’ve lost count. I have never so much as looked at another woman with lust.
I only say this because alot of time was spent on describing us as holding no value to our marriages, which is the stereotype polar opposite of the truth that we can’t seem to get conveyed and which you obviously also believe.
My wife has long since left me because of these BS character labels. I am certain that there are many more spouses who have listened to this and believed that there must be some validity to this or you wouldn’t have spent so much time discussing it. My wife certainly did.
I am so sorry Chris. You clearly did not deserve the heaps of suspicion piled upon you. I am an INFJ married to an INTJ and I know his loyalty is boundless. I can rely upon his faithfulness as much as I can rely upon the faithfulness of the moon and sun. Your wife sounds like she had some serious trust issues that likely extended far beyond you. Again, I am sorry for your loss, but you deserve someone who trusts you. Suspicion and distrust is a rotten foundation for love.
I probably came across a little harsh. I apologize for that. I appreciate your response also.
My point, in summary, was that someone that does not have a maturity level, especially an ISFJ in the “grip”, will look for things that validate their “victim” mindset, and perhaps keeping this in mind would be helpful in the future.
I would guess that most people who use this sites resources for growth and understanding, myself included, may not necessarily have the maturity to understand others processing methods.
There are likely many on here who are trying to understand the thought process of someone important to them, also includes me, and something like the “cheating” example could be misinterpreted.
You guys are doing a great job, and when the money permits, I will purchase the growth package for my type. I only learned of the personality types a few months ago. This has been an eye opening experience.
Thanks Chris. You make a very good point. I wish there was a way everyone’s needs could be met when we present information. As our audience base grows we are becoming more and more aware of the fact that we will inevitably say something that someone finds off-putting. However, our intention is to grow and learn alongside our community and we will endeavor to make the necessary adjustments to minimize offense.
Be kind to yourself, Chris.
Hi Antonia, Joel and Charis,
I enjoyed this episode very much and it definitely helps me understanding myself (i think INTJ) and my needs and my partner and his needs (ENTP) and our misunderstandings.
I honor sustainability and self-care strongly and I dislike (emotional) dependence – for me this is always a sign for something being severely off that needs fixing – not just accepting. (I might seem cold because of that.)
I enjoy being around people who take care of stuff, being it there own needs or mine. Just knowing that I can rely on someone getting his/her sh*t done gives me the feeling of being in a good place. Otherwise I can be read as controlling and condescending – nothing I want to be in a relationship.
It also is very true what you were saying about the TPs trying to educate on their lovers and to become a better partner in the process. I definitely notice this behaviour with my current love to a point where it is almost comical (“Am I doing that right? How much sugar do you prefer your coffee with today?”) but I love this sincerity regarding my happiness.
So, thanks a lot for this podcast and your work. It is a pleasure learning from you.
Thanks for the feedback, Carol! We appreciate you. 🙂
Good episode! Definitely one I will listen to several times.
The only sad part was when you fumbled with an example during TJ. You almost made it sound like TJ:s are more likely to cheat on their spouse because the way they see a relationship, which is by far NOT true. Speaking as a TJ, It was almost hurtful that you would bring up the cheating example in such a way as if cheating was more associated with the TJ-type then any other.
I just hope listeners understand that cheating is just as likely amongst any type.
Yeah, that’s definitely not what we intended to convey. We were talking about a very specific form of loyalty Effectiveness users maintain which isn’t necessarily sexual fidelity (though it CAN include that, too).
My apologies if it felt we were indicating TJs cheat more than other types. We even made sure to say we trust that people will understand what we don’t mean all Effectiveness users are cheaters.
-A-
As an INTP, I thought the section on Accuracy love was pretty good. You’re totally right about looking for constructive criticism, that an important way of receiving love is to have the other person help you be a better person and more competent. People tend to assume that I will get hurt if they criticize me, partly because many people are, and partly because when they do it I start thinking about it and have some sort of expression of concentration that they think means hurt but really doesn’t. Anyhow, it quite annoys me, because it prevents lots of growth that could so easily happen if people were just open.
I also agree that being understood is very important, and being able to get thoughts across to others. I find this quite a bit more important than competency in many ways. One of the times I most feel loved is when people find my mind interesting enough to keep talking to me for a long time, to listen to me even if I am rambling, to ask me questions and to give me new ideas or refine my existing ones. So perhaps it is a form of competency after all… that my mind is competent enough to keep them interested. Though I’m wondering if it’s also related to my Exploration function. Being boring is one of my larger insecurities, and a lot of Exploration seems to be about new and interesting and exciting connections.
And also accurate: I have definitely asked significant others why they were with me, why they loved me. I realized afterwards that it probably looked insecure, but that wasn’t why I was asking.
Thanks for the comment, Rachel! I’m glad the info seemed to resonate with you so well. 🙂
Where can I find the transcript for this? Thanks!
We don’t do transcripts of the podcasts. At some point there will be podcast notes. In the meantime, this podcast was based on an article we wrote here:
https://www.personalityhacker.com/personality-type-ask-love/
Hope that helps. 🙂
-A-
ENTJ here. I really don’t want to spend over an hour just sitting and listening to a podcast. I’ve tried listening while working on other stuff, but my mind just ends up blocking out your content. Would really appreciate it if transcripts are made available, or at least your rough plans/pointers with regards to the podcast, especially because I read way faster than I can listen.
I think your description of TJ’s love style is spot on, and I totally understand the point you were making with the emotional infidelity vs. abandoning the relationship entirely therefore disrupting the nuts-and-bolts of daily family life.
I think TJs are more inclined to “work” in a relationship; i.e. they actually work for the relationship in tangible ways, that don’t base a sustainable relationship merely on emotional back-and-forth. They are expedient in organizing and effectively running a household and they understand that a strong emotional connection is necessary for a strong relationship–but they are realistic.
As in, you can whisper sweet nothings to your soulmate all you want, but who’s gonna go to work?
Budget?
Organize?
Deal with pets, children, dry cleaning, retirement savings, buying houses, cars, setting up college funds?, etc. etc.
And not just doing these things, but doing them in a very financially smart, calculated, (hopefully) lucratively-strategic way.
Building for the future is something a TJ does naturally, and whomever is a Partner of a TJ also benefits from this.
We are happy to be of service, but this benefit-by-proxy is also not lost on us either.
We want to see our Partner making equal contributions to the Partnership in other ways (that are our Partners strengths).
We need to feel an equality, our Partner should not turn into someone we have to entirely take care of, both emotionally and financially (exactly what you guys said).
Love is necessary, but so is resource planning. And we find throughout life, that although people are very quick to jump into “love”, sometimes they are not so good at the practical matters of life in general.
TJs initially go into a relationship with strong emotional connections while seamlessly assuming more and more tactical responsibilities, because they’re naturally good at strategizing and building a system (and yes, for all the hopeless romantics out there, humans are a necessary part of any sociological system on Earth, including romantic pair-bond relationships, so yes, we use you as a resource, obviously).
I think where this emotional bond/familial obligation starts to split is when the TJ starts to feel as though their Partner (and this is literally a PARTNERSHIP, LLP, type situation to a TJ) starts to drop the ball, not live up to their own duties in this system that the TJ works tirelessly for. When this happens, the first thing the TJ rips off the table is their emotional connection with their Partner. It’s not in a punishing way. It’s merely because the TJ is working endlessly to meet the resource needs of the Partnership and takes that responsibility VERY seriously, and if they feel they are “in it alone now”, they don’t think that giving of themselves emotionally is warranted anymore.
The TJ might then feel justified in giving that emotional connection to someone else. TJs emotional connection is sustained by a shared independent, competent, resilient attitude with their Partner, and when that starts to fall apart, it is crushing for a TJ. It’s as if they feel that their strategic-resources based work in the relationship must be all their Partner needs them for, or they feel taken advantage of, so they’ll take back their emotional connection, and then it’s theirs to give to someone else.
So I understand (and agree) with everything you guys said, and I actually appreciated you being gutsy and observant and going there. As a female INTJ, I get looks all the time from my girlfriends when I differentiate between having an emotional connection with someone (nice) and having a workable, fair dynamic in a Partnership (necessary).
I strongly believe these are not mutually exclusive things, and the strongest relationships need a dose of reality (and honesty) about resource planning, as well as a strong emotional/sexual connection.
However, TJs can definitely sustain one without the other, especially, as you mentioned, out of a strong sense of obligation, or until they find a good exit strategy.
Thanks for the awesome pod-cast; keep up the somewhat controversial topics and how they relate back to different personalities. This is the stuff of real life.
Thanks for the feedback, C.C.! I found the TJ part very enlightening. I’m married to a TJ and it really opened my eyes to his expectations in a relationship. Recently, I forgot to pay a $15 parking ticket that he had handed me. He was frustrated when we got a bill in the mail for $67.
Then two days later we got pulled over for having expired registration. I thought I had renewed it and apparently hadn’t. My first thought was, “You could have been as responsible for this as I was. Why am I getting all the blame?” This podcast explained why. He trusted that I was the one to take care of those things and I let him down. After that, he drove us straight over to Staples so I could buy whatever I needed to make my job easier. I didn’t think I needed anything from Staples but I let him buy me whatever he wanted to put his mind at ease.
Hi, Charis! Yes the Staples trip is so something I would have done too. Actually I would have gone to Walmart or the Dollar Tree to get office supplies because I think Staples is so overpriced, but I digress 🙂 I think that TJs have an incredibly task-oriented and organized “head space” and we want our partners to be incredibly organized as well, even though we accept that other types simply aren’t, at least when it comes to remembering to pay random, non recurring bills like parking tickets and renewing registrations. I think TJ really accept that it’s just not a priority for other people to be so task-organized with something as unpleasant as paying bills and the general upkeep of monetary obligations. But, we still need as much help and teamwork as humanly possible from our partners. I think getting organizational supplies at Staples is a way he was trying to help you become more organized in order to help him take care of the household obligations. It’s classic “help me help you”, but in reverse. It’s help you, help me. We need help from our partners. TJs hope that the “problem” is simply disorganization (like a bill gets lost under a stack of newspapers because there isn’t a designated Accounts Payable folder in the home office), because if the problem isn’t disorganization, we’re going to start assuming that our partner isn’t interested in the relationship anymore, or is expecting us to do all the work, which is devastating. But disorganization is a simple fix for us. Hence, Staples. If the actually problem is not a lack of organization skills, but rather that our partner simply HATES keeping track of bills, then we just want that communicated back to us so we can tweak the system and take on that task 100% while allowing our partners to (hopefully) relieve us from a task that maybe we’d rather not do that suites their strengths better. TJs try to achieve the ultimate juggling act, and how functional our marriages are is a reflection back to ourselves, each, as individuals…so we take functionality super seriously. The one thing I will say is NEVER stop communicating what you’re strengths and weaknesses are to a TJ, even if they are migratory, we expect this a part of human growth and have no problem re-framing the relationship to better suite our partners needs. The only thing we ever require is reciprocation of that sentiment 🙂
I felt like the discussion on how TJs love was a bit off and off-putting. Maybe it would be helpful for you to actually have some TJs actually talk about how they think about love and how they demonstrate love rather than trying to imagine it from your perspective.
TJs don’t just love for how someone else fits into their life, because they are a resource, or because someone else makes them look good. They are probably the least impulsive of all types and they do think long term, though.
As a TJ myself, whether it is in a romantic relationship or some other important relationship; I am motivated to think about what the other person needs from a practical standpoint. Your idea of “sharing resources” is pretty accurate, but it is not simply financial resources-it’s whatever I have that I can give-ideas, advice, material things, network, knowledge that I know will make the other persons life better or help them achieve whatever will make them happy.
It’s sad that this type of loving expression would seem less desirable than another type of expression- isn’t intent the most important thing? Also, don’t we each give out of the area where we are strong?
This makes so much sense.
I´m an INFJ – my mom is an ISFJ – and this is exactly how we both show and understand love.
A very good friend of mine is an ENFP – when you talked about the FP-types it sounded just like him!
My sister – an ISTJ – on the spot.
Best of all: I finally understand my husband 😉 (an ENTP <3 ) – or at least why we sometimes inadvertently hurt each other and misunderstand each other.
Thanks for a great podcast.
Thanks for the feedback, Annemarie! Sounds like you gained a lot of insight into your loved ones. I hope it helps with future misunderstandings. 🙂
Thanks guys for another great podcast! While listening to your podcast I really resonated with a combination of both the harmony (Fe) and thinking (Ti) ways of saying “I love you” (I’m an INFJ) and wonder if for all the types who are dominant perceivers, since their two judging functions are lower in the stack and close to one another if the ways they say “I love you” are slightly more hybrid of those two. While I resonate more with the harmony ways of saying “I love you”, I feel very strongly about the feedback/accuracy honesty aspect of Ti.
I totally agree Taylor! I was thinking the same thing as I was listening. As an INFJ I could see a lot of Fe and Ti in myself. Did you notice how Antonia took the lead on Ti and Fe (her copilot and 10 year old), and Joel took the lead on Fi and Te (his copilot and 10 year old)? I think that indicates your theory is accurate. 🙂 Great observation!
I had the same experience! The Fe section resonated with me extremely strongly, but parts of the Ti one did as well — much more than the other two. I find that I ask the question of “Do you love me?” using both Fe and Ti, but in terms of showing love, it’s only Fe. In other words, what I look for in partners and friends is not only safety, strong emotional connection, and reciprocation of my needs, but also affirmation that I’m worth it, that I’m good enough, that I’m doing well and not screwing up. I think the “searching for approval” part of the Fe section crosses over very well with the Ti section — I’d say I’m equally concerned with “am I good enough?” (Ti) and with “am I safe with you?” (Fe).
Really missed your podcasts.
Thanks for this new podcast
Greetings from a listener in India.
Thanks Jose! We had some technical difficulties. Recorded podcasts had to be trashed because of background noise. We finally got some new equipment, so it is full steam ahead! 🙂
This is the problem I have: About half the time I test as INTJ and the other half as INTP. Both ways make sense to me.
I always test as an INTJ but I think that INTP makes sense at times as well.
Wonderful episode! I’d love to hear your thoughts on how couples of varying types can best navigate their relationship.
“The more I love someone, the more I need them to see me as competent”
Yes! I need God to see me as competent.
Yes! I want to ask God ‘Why do you love me!?” .
My spiritual path includes trying to work out why God loves me.
I’d suggest that the “accuracy” types are the most forgiving of a confessed “sin”, because they value radical honesty (“I have done or think such and such a bad thing”) far more than goodness.
Thanks for your comment Mark! You bring up an interesting idea. “Accuracy types are the most forgiving of a confessed sin.” What sort of sin do you suppose would be unforgivable for an Accuracy user?